Granted that these so-called terrorists were taped discussing acts of terror and murder, granted they pleaded guilty, but what crimes did they actually commit?
Unsurprisingly, the authorities have put as much spin on this case as they could, that includes the trial judge, Mr Justice Wilkie, but if Zahid Iqbal, Mohammed Sharfaraz Ahmed, Umar Arshad and Syed Farhan Hussain are the best Al-Qaeda can manage nowadays, even the most die-hard of neo-cons should rethink the war on terror.
This was actually the third of a series of trials at Woolwich Crown Court; the second ended February 21 with the convictions of three men who had all pleaded not guilty
to similar "acts", although in their case there was little doubt that they had begun making meaningful preparations for carrying out actual terrorist acts. But these four muppets, well, judge for yourself from this short BBC report
They talked about the possibility of attaching explosives to a remote controlled toy care which they would then send under the gate of a local Territorial Army base.
Did they actually obtain explosives? More to the point, did they buy or steal a toy car? Can this be for real?
For those with longer memories, the name Dhiren Barot will sound familiar. Although there is no doubt that he was planning terrorist attacks in the UK, most of what he wrote about was in the realms of fantasy. Yet this braggadocio - made to his diary - earned him a life sentence
This latest gang of miscreants received considerably less, from eleven years down to five years and three months, but this is a long time for talking too loudly and too boastfully about acts of "terror" which most likely would never have come to fruition.