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Claims are being made that the meat production industry is to be blamed for cases of salmonella contamination of vegetables.
The Canadian Food Inspection Agency says that salmonella bacteria are found naturally in the intestines of animals, (especially poultry and swine), birds, reptiles, some pets and some humans. The bacteria can also be found in the environment.
If you eat food that has been contaminated by salmonella you may develop salmonellosis which is spread from person-to-person, animals/birds/reptiles-to-people and by consuming food which is contaminated with Salmonella. Both animals and people can be carriers.
The Food and Drug Administration has recently issued several warning and updates about salmonella and tomatoes. this is sufficient reason to start examining our relationship to where our food comes from and how it is possible for incidents like this to occur.
How does a tomato become infected by salmonella?
Alison Kilkenny who is a vegan which means she does not eat meat or anything that comes from animals recently found herself projectile vomiting into her toilet last week. The diagnosis was food-poisoning, tomatoes were suspected.
In 2006, the United Nations produced a report entitled Livestock's Long Shadow (pdf file).
Directly or indirectly, through grazing and through feedcrop production, the livestock sector occupies about 30 per cent of the ice free terrestrial surface on the planet. In many situations. livestock are a major source of land-based pollution emitting nutrients and organic matter, pathogens and drug residues into rivers, lakes and coastal seas.p.3
Kilkenny states that a recent census of produce outbreaks between 1996 and 2007 counted no fewer than 33 epidemics from salmonella-contaminated fruits and vegetables.
If we consider the food chain which can be defined as the transfer of food energy from plants to one or more animals; a series of plants and animals linked by their food relationships, we can begin to understand how a pathogen, for example, can flow from one species to another.
A small herd of beef cattle are out grazing in the field, there is a small stream running along one side of the field and the fence has been damaged in one section, or worse there is no barrier between the cattle and the water.
The cattle are thirsty and step into the stream and while they are in the stream they let go of some of their waste which flops into the stream. This begins the dissemination of whatever was in the cow's droppings.
The solution that Kilkenny puts forward is one that has been written about and discussed here at DJ, that it is time to buy your food from a local producer and this is a sensible solution. Organic growing does not protect you from salmonella, but if you buy your hamburger steak from a farmer who is selling direct through a farmer's market or farm gate sale, for example, you know exactly where the food came from and whom to talk to if there is a problem.
You may even be able to arrange a visit to the farm to see the operation for yourself, some small farms have set up days when visitors are welcome for farm tours.
As the price of food rises it seems reasonable to be concerned not only with the cost but with the quality of the food we eat after all are you really willing to pay to eat cow crap?
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Hack! I can remember my dad fertilizing our garden with cow poop, and I know that many people locally still repeat that practice.
Yuck.
Thanks for the heads-up on this one, Bob!
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Cow manure is usable but only after it has been properly aged or composted.
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@ Bob Ewing
Cow manure is usable but only after it has been properly aged or composted.
Whew! What I know my dad used was stuff that had been around for a while. Ditto w/the locals. -
@ Debra Myers (skyangel)
Whew! What I know my dad used was stuff that had been around for a while. Ditto w/the locals.
the heat will kill the pathogens. -
@ Bob Ewing
the heat will kill the pathogens.
Nothing like smoking poop! I mean that literally too! LOL! -
@ Debra Myers (skyangel)
Nothing like smoking poop! I mean that literally too! LOL!
now that made me laugh. -
I see the title was censored.
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@ Bob Ewing
now that made me laugh.
LOL! That's what I think about smoking those little cigars too!!!
@ Bob Ewing
I see the title was censored.
I see that too. Ah well...in some things we have to be PC. -
@ Debra Myers (skyangel)
LOL! That's what I think about smoking those little cigars too!!!
I see that too. Ah well...in some things we have to be PC.
I guess. -
I really wonder what is behind all of these "outbreaks" that keep happening. Are our bodies becoming so sterile and overmedicated that any little pathogen that normally would have just passed through our systems without a second glance will now glom onto whatever and totally mess us up?
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@ Carolyn E. Price (gohomelaker)
I really wonder what is behind all of these "outbreaks" that keep happening. Are our bodies becoming so sterile and overmedicated that any little pathogen that normally would have just passed through our systems without a second glance will now glom onto whatever and totally mess us up?
Not to mention all the preservatives and additives that are in our food, which didn't used to be there. -
Are our bodies becoming so sterile and overmedicated that any little pathogen this may be a factor. -
Did a cow crap in your tomatoes?......no, but maybe your next door neighbor did.
DULUTH, Minn. - Farmers in northeast Minnesota are using a fertilizer rich in phosphorus, nitrogen and organic matter that can boost crop yields by 80 percent. Best of all, it's free.
The problem, for some, is that it's made of treated human waste, which opponents say is environmentally unsafe and unhealthy for animals and other people.
"It's disgusting to think that everything we pour down our drains and flush down our toilets, in our homes and hospitals and paper mills, is ending up on our local farms," said Inese Holte, an area resident and longtime opponent. "What we're doing to our rural neighbors is awful. The farmers will take it because they are hurting and it's free. But we shouldn't be giving it to them at all."
True, they use animal waste for fertilizer, but it is way more gross when you realize that farms are using human waste as such as well. Think of the drugs and chemicals being expelled by humans (remember the story about all of the drugs in the public drinking water a couple months back?) - well, those same drugs are more than likely permeating into our food supply.
We're all on lipitor and prozac whether we like it or not! LOL!!
Great article Bob - loved the headline.....wondered what it said before it was "censored" but I have a good guess.
Here's another interesting site...... -
Pam...you brought up some valid points about the humanure. The last that I knew, (and this information is already half as old as my daughter!) human waste could be used on fields where grains and grasses were grown for stock consumption. but here you go again...cows eat it, then we eat the cows...and all I have to say is:
Ewwwwwwwwww!
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Thanks for the link PJ, humanure can be used on a small scale especially if the people making the contributions are drug free.
and Debra what goes around comes around such is the food chain, we really are what we eat. :)
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I know, Bob! LOL!
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Humanure?!?!?!
Oh, Pam, leave it to you to smear us with sh*t!
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I'm not at all concerned. In France I bought lettuce still rooted in fairly fresh horse manure.
At my local Canada Tire, I can buy steer manure, sheep manure, chicken manure and, I don't recall, but perhaps even Milorganite that I used to use in Ontario on my vegetable garden.
Milorganite?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milorganite
And there I was thinking that it was beer that made Milwaukee famous. -
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The manure you buy at CT is well aged or composted and if you are using fresh manure on your vegetables then you are simply asking for trouble.
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@ Bob Ewing
The manure you buy at CT is well aged or composted and if you are using fresh manure on your vegetables then you are simply asking for trouble.
Am well up on the composting scene and well, well,well aware, that these manures are not rectum-fresh. -
@ skeptikool
Am well up on the composting scene and well, well,well aware, that these manures are not rectum-fresh.
good for you, you are well steeped in manure. -
@ skeptikool
Am well up on the composting scene and well, well,well aware, that these manures are not rectum-fresh.
LOL!
@ Bob Ewing
good for you, you are well steeped in manure.
LMAO even harder!
Now this thread has gone to shit! -
Not to cut the crap butt....
Cow manure is not the only way that salmonella can get onto vegetables. Wildlife that cruise through the garden plot can leave evidence of their passage(s). These critters can and do spread pathogens. Some pathogens can live for a while in the soil. Long after the animal has departed.
In Florida the use of "municipal waste water residuals" aka bio solids are heavily regulated in the handling, transport and land applications of the crap. Lime and other additives are used to kill the pathogens along with composting before it can be used on vegetables or other crops aimed at human consumption. The minimally treated bio solids have additives mixed in to kill pathogens. This material can be spread on beef cow pastures (not dairy). However, livestock cannot be allowed to graze the area for at least 30 consecutive days after the application.
In my opinion, it is much more likely that a human contaminated the produce due to poor sanitation when picking or processing the produce. This might be as simple as someone getting his hands dirty when he tripped and fell. This could happen in the field, processing plant or grocery. Small, local sources can be contaminated as easily as larger farms and supermarkets.
It will be damned hard to find out where the contamination came from given the number of possible sources.
Now it's time to hit the trail, I really gotta go.;)
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This might be as simple as someone getting his hands dirty when he tripped and fell. This could happen in the field, processing plant or grocery. Small, local sources can be contaminated as easily as larger farms and supermarkets. possible, but what was the original source? -
possible, but what was the original source?
It's hard to know, it could have been a bird, a dog, a stray cat, a coyote, a cow, a person, a ........ Like I said it is hard to know for sure.
Given the widespread outbreak, I surmise that a processing or distribution plant may be involved. It may have been some foreign produce that was imported from areas where cleanliness is next to an impossibility. This is why many in the US agricultural business have been attempting to get congress to pass the Country Of Origin Labeling (COOL). COOL can help the consumers select produce from areas they trust.
The feds are scared to clamp down on everything until they are pretty sure of the source or run the risk of putting good people out of business. -
Given the widespread outbreak, I surmise that a processing or distribution plant may be involved This is a likely scenario. -
Congratulations, Bob. I knew you were open-minded enough to dig for the truth.
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@ Bob Ewing
Cow manure is usable but only after it has been properly aged or composted. Correct. That is why farms in the past had a dunghill. Unfortunately, the process is far from guaranteed. Because of that, manure remains always a very big risk. That is one of the main reasons humanity shifted towards artificial fertilizers: they are -as far as "germs" are concerned- as safe as achievable, since the process does not involve them. -
@ Bob Ewing
The manure you buy at CT is well aged or composted and if you are using fresh manure on your vegetables then you are simply asking for trouble. t is also specially treated to kill as many "germs" as possible. Don't try this with the dung of your own cow, unless you are prepared to heat it yourself and to expose it to UV radiation for a long time. -
@ Bob Ewing
possible, but what was the original source? All you need is, for example, a single person who goes in a grocery store and tries to "feel" which tomatoes he/she wants to buy. That is why, in some countries, one cannot simply go in a store and handle all tomatoes (grapes, carrots, whatever). One is supposed to buy what one touches, even if that turns out to be a less desirable item. -
@ Bob Ewing
this may be a factor. True, but it is an unlikely one. Bacteria are part of nature, they are the single most abundant expression of life on this planet. That is why we have such potent immune systems. People who are most likely going to be affected by "germs" are people with weakened immune systems, such as very young children, because their system isn't fully developed yet (which is why vaccination is such an enormous life saver in young children) and older people, because their isn't as strong as it used to be.
When someone doesn't "feel right" for a day or so, this may be because of the common cold, very often it is simply some salmonella, some listeria, some whatever that causes the issue. It only becomes a life-threatening problem when one is weak, or when one has to do with a particular virulent form. Unfortunately, that happens too. Evolution hasn't stopped. It continues. We see the results every day. -
@ Bob Ewing
the heat will kill the pathogens. Not quite. The heat is caused by bacteria in the first place. The heat will kill some pathogens, others will be unaffected. -
@ Bart B. Van Bockstaele
Not quite. The heat is caused by bacteria in the first place. The heat will kill some pathogens, others will be unaffected. I would have no problem and have done so, eating food that was grown using composted manure, in fact have grown quite a number of crops in it or with it and have not been sick. -
@ Bob Ewing
I would have no problem and have done so, eating food that was grown using composted manure, in fact have grown quite a number of crops in it or with it and have not been sick. That is the personal experience trap, a fallacy which is easy to fall into.
Medicine is not an exact science, it is a statistical science. That is why education is so important. There is no such thing as "safe" food and "unsafe" food. There is unsafe food, and slightly less unsafe food.
People who are generally healthy and wo have normal immune systems will just about never have a problem. People who have a weakened immune system have more risk. The lettuce you grow, with manure (just about the only fertilizer allowed in organic farming) will not bother most people, but it just might kill them. Be very careful, when you get older, the same stuff that does not give you any problems now, may well suddenly kill you. -
That is the personal experience trap, a fallacy which is easy to fall into. No trap at all, as there are many others who are doing the same and have done so and documented their experience. the Rodale Institue is one such organization.
Bart do you grow any food? Have you done so over a period of years and observed and recorded the process? -
@ Bob Ewing
No trap at all, as there are many others who are doing the same and have done so and documented their experience. the Rodale Institue is one such organization. It is a trap. Consider this as a nice example (admittedly a very shrill one). One of the most common arguments of smokers against anti-smoking initiatives is that they all know someone who is 70, 80, 100 years old as the case may be and who smokes like a steam locomotive. These people do exist. Unfortunately, this type of personal experience is the weakest evidence of all. It is what we call anecdotal evidence. That does not mean it has no value. It does mean that its value is usually limited to being an indicator, not a basis for general conclusions.
@ Bob Ewing Bart do you grow any food? Have you done so over a period of years and observed and recorded the process? I have, a very long time ago. I live at Gerrard and Yonge in Toronto, in a 34 story building. Let's just say that farming is not exactly an option in these circumstances. And that is precisely one of the problems with farming. There are about 410 appartments here, and approximately 1000 people. Imagine the urban sprawl that would result from flattening it all out and allowing for personal gardens. It is why I have advocated building "farming buildings", appartment-like buildings that would be dedicated to farming, or farming floors, just like we have laundry floors. There are enough people in a building like this to enable a farmer or two earning a decent living farming inside the building, using mainly hydroponics. A lot is to be said for hydroponics. Because most everything can be easily automated and tightly controlled, the use of pesticides can often be reduced to zero or near-zero levels. There is hardly any waste. At least where vegetables are concerned.
Our needs for animal protein, and yes, it is a need, can be easily satisfied by raising rabbits, chickens, guinea pigs, rats. Eminently doable in farming buildings. Fish can be done as well, but that would be the hardest part.
The only problem with this type of farming is that a single contamination by a single bacterium/fungus... can destroy an entire crop. A very serious worry. The only way to defend against that is a continuous overproduction (but that is true for any and all farming).
That said, I have -also a long time ago- had a lot of fun growing vegetables and fruits in my apartment. I had lettuce, radishes, sun flowers, strawberries, canteloupes and spaghetti squash, tomatoes, and a few others I don't remember right now. It worked beautifully. I also had asparagus. That was an utter failure.
I enjoyed it tremendously, but the scientist in me feels it necessary to issue a warning. Produce grown at home this way is highly contaminated and it is not a good idea to consume it, except in very small quantities. These are not healthful foods. -
Bart the comparison is false I am not talking about anecdotes such as the smoking one but actually growing, observing and recording and eating the food.
I have done this and worked with others who have done the same this is not an anecdotal experience. There are many others such as Rodalee who have undergone the same or more likely an even more rigorous process.
This statement is pure nonsense. Produce grown at home this way is highly contaminated and it is not a good idea to consume it
There are other fallacies in your understanding of agriculture and growing food, as well as what we need to consume. but they will take too much space to point out.
People do not need meat, if you want to eat it fine, go ahead but it is not essential.
Small livestock can be raised in urban environments, chickens and goats, for example, and backyards can be converted from lawn to food forests and all the food will be healthy.
I asked about gardening because your writing indicates you do not really understand the science behind growing food. -
I am not going to start another lengthy argument. I don't have the time. I can only say that there is a very big difference between desirability and reality. One can very well desire something but that doesn't make it so.
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@ Bart B. Van Bockstaele
I am not going to start another lengthy argument. I don't have the time. I can only say that there is a very big difference between desirability and reality. One can very well desire something but that doesn't make it so. A very irrelevant and unscientific statement. Add a Comment
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Opinion: Did A Cow Crap in Your Tomatoes?
