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"Nappy Headed Ho's" is a drop in the bucket compared to the litany of demeaning and insulting lyrics launching black men with gangster personas to the top of the music charts! Have you ever read the words of these "rap" songs?? I was shocked!!
I am astonished at the attention that is being heaped upon Don Imus head in reaction to his statement regarding the women players on the Rutger's University basketball team.
"Man, they got tattoos and some hard-core hos," he said. "That's some nappy-headed hos there, I'm going to tell you that now."
Oh my! How awful! What could this man be thinking to utter such a horrid litany of insulting and demeaning remarks directed at these accomplished young women?
News conferences are held, Mr. Imus is subjected to personal attacks from every direction. The Rutger's coach stood at the podium and ripped him for over 20 minutes. He appeared with Rev. Al Sharpton for a 2 hour "beat down". The man has practically crawled on his belly apologizing, but to no avail. Talk about a lynch mob!!
The video I posted with this story is the number one rap track by a new sensation who goes by the name of "Mims." The "song" is "This Is Why I'm Hot." It has topped the charts for the last 15 weeks. Did you pick up on the basic message he is sending here?...........
First of all, let's explore Don's statement? Where did he come up with words like "Nappy and Ho" in the first place? Oh yes, I remember. Ebonics.
Ebonics is greatly misunderstood, largely because of how it gained global attention during a racially charged education controversy in Oakland, California. On Dec. 18, 1996, the Oakland School Board passed a resolution declaring Ebonics to be the language of 28,000 African-American students within that school district. Few people had ever heard of the term Ebonics prior to the passage of that resolution, to say nothing of how it was created or originally defined.
Following this ruling, the school board adopted resolutions directed at modifying the method that African-American students were taught and tested and stated that it was necessary to implement ways to teach these 28,000+ students in their own language.
It was now official - the "ebonics" language now belonged specifically to African-American men and women to be used and promoted at all levels, from education on up.
Say what? So, African-Americans have their own language......and apparently those of us from other races are not to use or implement this language into our own daily speech. Unless, I guess, we are part of the rapper crowd like Eminem?! Is that it?
Here is a translation of a popular Notorious Big rap tune from Ebonics to English - (the white man's language?)
Lyrics:
First things first, I poppa, freaks all the honeys
Dummies - playboy bunnies, those wantin’ money
Those the ones I like ‘cause they don’t get nathan’
But penetration, unless it smells like sanitation
Garbage, I turn like doorknobs
Heart throb, never, black and ugly as ever
However, I stay coochied down to the socks
Rings and watch filled with rocks
TRANSLATION:
As a general rule, I perform deviant sexual acts with women of all kinds, including but not limited to those with limited intellect, nude magazine models, and prostitutes. I particularly enjoy sexual encounters with the latter group as they are generally disappointed in the fact that they only receive penile intercourse and nothing more, unless of course, they douche on a consistent basis. Although I am extremely unattractive, I am able to engage in these types of sexual acts with some regularity. Perhaps my sexuality is somehow related to my fancy and expensive jewelry.
Ok, is it just me, or is there a bit more going on here than merely a "language" difference? Does there not seem to be a quite obvious underlying message being relayed in the lyrics of this song? And all of those like it?
This particular song continues through some additional crude bars.......then
Lyrics:
Where you at? Flippin’ jobs, playin’ car notes?
While I’m swimmin’ in ya women like the breast stroke
Right stroke, left stroke what’s the best stroke
Death stroke - tongue all down her throat
Nuthin’ left to do but send her home to you
I’m through - can ya sing the song for me, boo?
TRANSLATION:
You, on the other hand, jump from job to job, barely able to maintain payments on the Mercedes Benz you purchased for your woman. Meanwhile, I continue to engage in sexual intercourse and commit lewd osculatory acts with your women. My only remaining option is to request that she leave my home and return to you because I have reached orgasm and no longer have a need for her presence.
And finishes with:
Lyrics:
High fashion - flyin’ into all states.
Sexin’ me while your man masturbates.
Isn’t this great? Your flight leaves at eight.
Her flight lands at nine, my game just rewinds.
Lyrically I’m supposed to represent.
I’m not only the client, I’m the player president
TRANSLATION:
You will be dressed in finest clothes on the runways of Paris. I will fly you to every state to shop for fine clothes and jewelry. You will enjoy sexual intercourse with me and your man will be forced to pleasure himself through manual stimulation. What a life! I’ll return you to LaGuardia in time to catch your 8 o’clock flight. The timing is perfect because I have scheduled a date with a second woman who arrives at the same gate at 9 o’clock. I’ll seduce her in the same way that I seduced you. I rap well and I am a positive reflection of my home town. Not only am I a sexually deviant, misogynistic, immoral, wealthy, male prostitute, but I also sit on the board of directors of the organization that governs others of my kind.
So, what have we just heard here? That the rich, black men that sing hip hop and rap are loaded with cash. Since they have so much money they are able to seduce any woman they want, and do so over and over. They enjoy belittling any man that doesn't have the money, which translates to power, that they have and also enjoy degrading all women and using them as their sexual toys and, when finished, toss them aside like yesterday's trash.
Hey, great message 'eh?
But wait a minute......Who does this Don Imus think he is to refer to black women as "nappy headed ho's"?? What an outrage!
I think the Reverend Sharpton and the head coach of the Rutger's basketball team, as well as the female players, the media and the masses have formed a lynch mob in search of the wrong culprit.
Where are the black voices speaking out against the absolute degradation of black women in rap music? Why is there no outrage against the perpetrators of this mind set against their own race?
If they don't want to be looked at in the light they themselves cast upon their own race, then why don't they stop singing about such awful things? A team member says she understands that Rap Music "has desensitized America to such phrases and words - but that is no excuse". How is it not? I don't get it. How can you run down your own people and then get mad when others start to think the same way?
Why doesn't the honorable Reverand Sharpton take a stand against the mind set being promoted by his own people against his own people? Isn't that really the core issue here? Why work so hard to create this racial divide - which is essentially what this whole Don Imus thing is doing - without first acknowledging that you, the blacks, are creating it?!
The lyrics I used here were mild compared to what is out there. You can visit this site and pull up the words to most of the top rappers on the Billboard Charts today. I am certain you will be as shocked as I was to see just what these people are singing about and promoting. It is, to put it mildly, horrifically frightening.
Can someone tell me, why is it that rappers can sing hateful ugly songs and use words like "N"'r, slut, ho, bitch, pimp, on and on and on with not a peep out of society as a whole? Fear? Ignorance?
Perhaps........but my guess is Money. Big Business.
Record studios are reaping huge profits from these "artists" - and I use the term lightly. "They" don't really care what the message is. "They" don't care if the youth of this country are growing up listening day in and day out to lyrics that perpetuate hatred, sexual deviancy, anger and violence.
Just keep the paychecks coming...........What a sad and sorry commentary on America.
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rap music has nothing to do with Imus' statement. he's a man of the media...he's got a celebrity seal stamped on him and for him to say something offensive to anyone is going to cause a problem. to be honest it slipped out of his mouth and it just goes to show that he prolly says stuff like this around his peers when he's not at his job. i'm sure Oprah says the "n-word" when she's home in her $50 million mansion.
rap music is degrading, its violent, its alot of things but if the black community (and i'm speaking on behalf of my black family) were so offended by it, there wouldn't be music like it out today. the same goes when Twisted Sister and Judas Priest were set up for jail time for their music back in the 80s cuz it was believed that "satan" and their music caused kids to kill themselves. music is music..take it as it is. if people are going around doing stupid stuff like killing or harming people just cuz the music told them THATS ON THEM. and besides rappers they may be shouting out that they've got cash...when really in the music business the artists is the last to receive a paycheck and even then they gotta pay back everything they used to give them their 15mins of fame. its all glamor nothing more.
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@ alia7368:
rap music is degrading, its violent, its alot of things but if the black community (and i'm speaking on behalf of my black family) were so offended by it, there wouldn't be music like it out today.
Then why are they offended when a white guy in the media uses the same language? [Public media/Imus...Public music media/Rappers] I think Scoop has made an excellent commentary here. It really rings true and begs the question.
EXCELLENT POST SCOOP!!!
Very informative as always. Thanks! -
Great post GTS, well done, I spoke to many African Americans they feel the same about Rap Music and Imus. They say we have far more serious problems than this. They should focus on that instead of drumming one stupid thing. Some people like Rev. Shrapton are just making a loud noise for one thing and blind to lots of other things that goes on. This doesn't help quell racism. They punish one guy for words, what about Snoop dog he does lots of crazy things, yet he goes on doing more things. They have punished Imus enough, I doubt he will repeat this again, if he does it again fire him. Imus will talk to Rutgers players and if those players and coach still feels like Imus has to be fired, let them follow it.
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@ alia7368:
and besides rappers they may be shouting out that they've got cash...when really in the music business the artists is the last to receive a paycheck and even then they gotta pay back everything they used to give them their 15mins of fame. its all glamor nothing more.
Well, if they aren't making any money then why are their homes featured on "Cribs" on MTV and they are all about the "bling" and promote things like "grills" which are solid gold mouthpieces encrusted with diamonds?? C'mon now, you can't seriously be trying to tell me that these rappers aren't pulling down some huge amounts of $$$ all at the expense of their own people!! -
It was simply racist and misogynistic. There's no excuse for it. He should lose his job over it. How is he any different from Michael Richards or Mel Gibson?
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Great post once again GTS.
I see this as something promoted by Sharpton. On another post here there is a black woman who is more out raged that Sharpton is doing this. I did see on Fox a black comedian who thinks this is crazy.
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He's a shock-jock radio personality, personally, I think he should have apologized--but not to that piece of crap Al Sharpton. Sharpton sure as hell isn't someone who can talk about racism (just look at his record of inciting hatred against the Jewish communities of New York,etc).
but again, this is something different--he's white. It's ok for a black rapper to say "bitches" and "hos" in their songs, degrade the women to no end..but in the end, like GTS says, pull down huge amounts of bank at the expense of their own people.
Also, rap is not the same as the rock and roll of the 80s. In the 80s, it was perceived threat of corruption. Now, rap has already corrupted the youth. Look at all of the kids today, consumerism knows no bounds. $150 for a pair of shoes--because they see their idols praise that type of outrageous spending--gaudy jewelry, rims/spinners that really serve no purpose--and the worst part of it, they see the 'gangsta' lifestyle of 'bitches' and 'cheese' (women and money through less than scrupulous means), and try to emulate it. It's a sad state of affairs.
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So true BobSP! I mentor a little black girl and her 12 year old brother desperately wants a "grill"! That gold mouthpiece thing with jewels in it......he is 12! Her mother has said absolutely not. I had to ask Kathryn what a grill even was. She explained it to me and said all of the kids in her neighborhood either have them or want them - even the girls.
She loves rap music, and is also all about getting rich and having a big SUV and lots of jewelry and clothes. She is very poor, but whenever her mom offers to buy her something new to wear she always picks new tennis shoes - I am sure that is because of the way her mind is being formed through the messages of rap music. It is really sad to see what this stuff is doing to the black youth! And to think they care so little about their own people! Or, perhaps it is just that the blacks out there that do care really don't have a voice. Someone legitimate speaking for them.......cuz we all know it isn't the likes of Al Sharpton.
How he managed to get himself into the position of official spokesperson for "black America" is beyond comprehension!
And I agree 100% that Imus screwed up horribly when he said what he did. He has apologized over and over to no avail.....
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This is an excellent article, Scoop. I'm glad you took the time to write it.
What bothered me the most about this whole Imus thing was when Sharpton tried to make a second big stink because Imus said something to the effect of "you people." Holy oversensitive! I can't think of a single day that I haven't used "those people" or "these people" or "you people" in my speech. I guess I must be racist since I am singling out groups of people.
In fact, look at this:
@ Lightening:
Then why are they offended when a white guy in the media uses the same language?
According to "Reverend" Sharpton's logic, that would be a racist statement. "Why are THEY offended..."
I always thought Bill Cosby had some excellent thoughts on ebonics and rappers.
There are much worse things being broadcast over the radio than "nappy haired hos." All I have to do is turn the noisebox on for five minutes and I'll hear something much worse than what Imus said, whether it be in commentary or in song.
And anyway, since when is Imus an authority on looks? Has he looked at himself in the mirror lately? Dude looks like a perma-constipated bag of skelebones...and that cowboy hat isn't doing much to hide his blown out locks. C'mon people... who gets offended by some idiot on the radio? Just turn it off. -
Don.
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Of all the people who have no business getting upset about what people say the so called “Reverend” Sharpton is up near the head of the list along with Jesse “Hymie Town” Jackson. Sharpton was fined $395 MILLION for shooting his mouth off in the Tawana Brawley scam and Jackson “apologized” for his anti-Semitic remark but did not lose his job.
Of course all the fuss over at Fox is just hot air since they have continued to support that crazy drag queen Ann Coulter even after her “Fag” remark about Sen. Edwards and her insane ranting about the wives of 9/11 victims being happy their husbands died.
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Why was it ok for Stevie Wonder to use the words Nappy hair in one of his songs?
I do not think this man deserves to lose his job over this.
I also believe if you want to stop certain words from being said, it has to stop on all sides. Why is it ok for one race to use certain words but if someone else uses the same words in the same context but they are a different race, it is bad.
I do not understand this.
I for one do not like racist words at all. Said by any race.
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GTS, great OP/ED piece but I do disagree with a few of these points, as well as some of the comments. And as the true fence-sitter that I am, I also agree with a few. Where to start?
I think Imus deserves the public flogging because he's a public figure, he's white, wealthy and what he says will impact people because his audience is large. Sure, rap lyrics contain worse, but they are written by a culture that lives it, accepts it and relates to it. I don't think a comparison to rap music, in this case, is a totally level comparison. To relate it to something more close to home GTS, it would be (in my humble opinion) like a Muslim, Buddhist or Atheist using religious verbiage out of context, or inappropriately. This is a soft example, but there are many very religious Christians who believe cussing by saying "Jesus Christ" is using the Lord's name in vain. To Christians, it's hurtful (or could be). Maybe not the best example, but my point is that Imus is not part of rap culture so should not be compared to it.
As a public figure, Imus needs to be held to a different standard. What if President Bush, the Pope, or the Queen of England were to say the exact same words? Just because it's said in rap lyrics does not give them the right to use language that is offensive. He called these women ho's -- hookers! The "Nappy headed" part is describing anatomy/body features in a very degrading (if not racist) manner.
Furthermore, what if at work, your boss called you a "Nappy Headed Ho". You would scream (a) verbal/sexual harrasment for being called a hooker (b) the racial remark is condescending and degrading to you as a person and (c) you would never be able to feel equal, as your boss clearly looks at you through a twisted prism. Now, just because rappers say it doesn't give your boss the right to say it.
Comparing Imus to lyrics in rap music is comparing apples to oranges.
I agree completely with alia7368 who says: @ alia7368:
...Rap music is degrading, its violent, its alot of things but if the black community...were so offended by it, there wouldn't be music like it out today. The same goes when Twisted Sister and Judas Priest were set up for jail time for their music back in the 80s cuz it was believed that "satan" and their music caused kids to kill themselves.
I disagree with bobSP here, as I really don't think "rap has already corrupted the youth. Look at all of the kids today, consumerism knows no bounds." Rap music has influenced today's youth, but I don't think you can peg consumerism solely on a genre of music -- it's much more. It's television, radio, the internet, peer pressure, advertising, pop culture, other music genres like skater/punk culture (face it, it's just a different type of conformity), it's modern media and the way society has evolved -- so many people are measured on how much stuff they have. There are many people who hate rap that still weigh life on this scale.
I do agree that a lot of today's rap is degrading to women, it fantasizes reality, it promotes acquiring wealth as a measure of personal worth, etc. But Imus cannot be excused because of what happens with musicians. He is a media icon who only uttered three little words that held a hell of a lot of meaning. Forget Sharpton, critics, all of them. Just measure Imus and Imus alone.
Good post Scoop. I totally disagree, but it's nice to see varying opinions and a lot of effort put into building an argument. You get my upvote for a quality article. -
rap really isn't the only musical genre that has degrading lyrics. Emo/punk/rock all of them have said some nasty things about women.
What I don't understand is why people get offended over the subject when someone says something as opposed to when someone sings about it.
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Chris Hoggs says: Sure, rap lyrics contain worse, but they are written by a culture that lives it, accepts it and relates to it.
[Ol' Dirty Bastard]
Yea, gotta come back to attack
Killin niggaz who said they got stacks, cause I don't give a fuck
{*inhales*} I wanna see blood, whether it's period blood
or bustin your fuckin face, some blood!!
I'm goin out my FUCKIN mind!!
Everytime I get around devils {*breathing hard*}
Let me calm down, you niggaz better start runnin
Cause I'm comin, I'm dope like fuckin heroin
Wu-Tang Bloodkin, a goblin, who come tough like lambskin
Imagine, gettin shot up with Ol Dirty insulin {*sucks air*}
You bound to catch AIDS or somethin
Not sayin I got it, but nigga if I got it you got it!!
WHAT?!? {*echoes*}
So, Chris, you're telling me that rap music is a reflection of the Black culture. This is what the live, what they relate to, who they are as a people?
Chris, I don't get your logic at all. If the example of rap lyrics I just quoted is truly a realistic reflection of the "black culture", the one you said they live, accept and relate to.....well, I'd say we have got a big problem in the Black Community!
To relate it to something more close to home GTS, it would be (in my humble opinion) like a Muslim, Buddhist or Atheist using religious verbiage out of context, or inappropriately.
And you feel that a better correlation would be Religion - and that Christians would rise up against someone if they said "Jesus Christ" as a cuss word and feel that they had been deeply offended, just as these black basketball players had been by Mr. Imus remarks....is that what you're telling me?? So, if Mr. Imus had said, on air, "Jesus Christ, what are those players thinking with a shot like that" - you believe that the media would be all over him, he would be called before the Christian council or whomever, that he would be making the rounds on every talk show and apologizing for using "Jesus Christ" in a swearing manner and the media would just rally 'round and beat him down for having the audacity to take the Lord's name in vain. You aren't serious are you? Is that truly what you are trying to say here Chris?
Chris, the real heart of the matter is that this is about creating anomosity between the blacks and the whites. It sells papers. It gets people tuned in. It riles them up. Just like the Duke case did when those 3 TOTALLY INNOCENT young men were charged with raping that poor innocent black exotic dancer! Oh, never mind that there was no evidence. Never mind that the girl was a stripper. Never mind that - it was a black/white thing - sold commercials. Sold papers, brought in the cash!
I'm sorry, but I stand by my original point which is that the so called representatives of the Black Culture need to take a step back and take a look at what their people are promoting among their own, and if you are correct in stating that they are accepting this as normal - it is time to stop!
Holding one white man accountable for what they have perpetuated in their own culture is simply wrong. -
@ Samantha A. Torrence:
What I don't understand is why people get offended over the subject when someone says something as opposed to when someone sings about it.
I think a lot of that can be chalked up to so-called "artistic integrity," although with lines like 'But penetration, unless it smells like sanitation' and ' Sexin’ me while your man masturbates' ... you're hitting pretty low on the totem pole there. Whoops, did I just offend Native Americans? Are we that sensitive as a society now?
I just don't understand all the fuss around Imus. Maybe it's just because hardly anything offends me. I would certainly never say anything like he did, not only because I don't make racist comments, but most importantly because I have a brain that functions at least at half throttle most of the time.
If Don Imus came on my radio and said "Carpenter Newton is a glasses wearing cracker boy," I'd just turn him off and not listen to him anymore. And then probably go get some pizza or something.
Mmm... thin crust. -
@ Carpenter S. Newton:
I think a lot of that can be chalked up to so-called "artistic integrity," although with lines like 'But penetration, unless it smells like sanitation' and 'Sexin’ me while your man masturbates' ... you're hitting pretty low on the totem pole there. Whoops, did I just offend Native Americans? Are we that sensitive as a society now?
I just don't understand all the fuss around Imus. Maybe it's just because hardly anything offends me. I would certainly never say anything like he did, not only because I don't make racist comments, but most importantly because I have a brain that functions at least at half throttle most of the time.
If Don Imus came on my radio and said "Carpenter Newton is a glasses wearing cracker boy," I'd just turn him off and not listen to him anymore. And then probably go get some pizza or something.
Mmm... thin crust.
Lol! Good points. ;-) -
So, Chris, you're telling me that rap music is a reflection of the Black culture. This is what the live, what they relate to, who they are as a people?
No, rap music is a reflection of rap culture. A lot of their audience may be black, but I wouldn't say rap is a reflection of black culture (neither would I say country music reflects white culture).
As for the "Jesus Christ" comment: No, the media definitely wouldn't be all over him. I was just trying to prove a point with saying things about a culture to which you don't belong. Soft example, as I admitted, but it's what first came to mind for me because I got lambasted by a Greek Orthodox woman years back when I said "Jesus Christ" to express frustration. Poor example.
Chris, the real heart of the matter is that this is about creating anomosity between the blacks and the whites. It sells papers.
I don't think this is a media ploy to create animosity. Sure it sells papers. Everything controversial does. But it's not meant to create animosity between races. Quite simply, the white guy said something about black people he shouldn't have.
It gets people tuned in. It riles them up. Just like the Duke case did when those 3 TOTALLY INNOCENT young men were charged with raping that poor innocent black exotic dancer! Oh, never mind that there was no evidence. Never mind that the girl was a stripper. Never mind that - it was a black/white thing - sold commercials. Sold papers, brought in the cash!
What does this have to do with Imus?
I'm sorry, but I stand by my original point which is that the so called representatives of the Black Culture need to take a step back and take a look at what their people are promoting among their own, and if you are correct in stating that they are accepting this as normal - it is time to stop!
See, nobody appointed rappers the ambassadors for black people -- you did that. How is it a black person's responsibility to say what "their people" can sing about? No black person that I know would say rappers speak on their behalf. They are just musicians who happen to be black. And not all of them are. And using your logic here, I should be writing letters to every white person that says something stupid. That would be taking a look at what "my people" are doing, wouldn't it? Seems pretty silly.
@ Carpenter S. Newton:
I just don't understand all the fuss around Imus. Maybe it's just because hardly anything offends me. I would certainly never say anything like he did, not only because I don't make racist comments, but most importantly because I have a brain that functions at least at half throttle most of the time.
I am the exact same way. Almost nothing offends me, but I sure as hell see why this could offend someone else. -
Hi Scoops
Thanks for alerting me to your thread and the very interesting comment s posted by everyone. As I don't have much time tonight, I'll refrain from saying too much other than I HATE rap music. I hate its crudity and I also cannot for the life of me call it "music". It's just rambling and usually to beats or borrowed music from something else. Artistic? Well maybe but I've missed the point somewhere.
The only time I enjoyed rap was watching the "Rapping Granny" on America's Got Talent. Anyone see that besides me?
I think you've raised a very interesting subject here, but again, I get nervous when people generalize: I've said this before on DJ: all generalizations are false. Rap music does not represent the morals, outlooks, lifestyles etc of all black people. It is the language and "music" of a certain segment of the black population. As Chris says, and rightly so, this is what that segment relates to because that's what they've grown up with, just as surely as some of us grow up with certain religions or cultural differences etc.
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a few references:
one Rap, Black Rage, and Racial Difference
Does Hip-Hop Hate Women?
another article.
I like to voice my opinion as much as the next guy but some issues require deeper research first and there are some things i can't really see because i don't live the life.
Imus was wrong and he should be gone. -
This is so over the top.... Imus is known as a shock jock like Howard Stern, and although I am not saying what he said was right, but, why is everyone acting like this is a shock?? He has been very opinionated, and has said things before.....to me, this isn't any worse than when Isiah Washington threw the word "fag" out toward his own co-star!!!
I am sorry but I feel sometimes blacks take things too far in the racial issues!!! It is a card they all love to play, and they know they can. You don't see us making huge issues when someone refers to us as donkeys, that's offensive.....no, we blow it off and keep living our lives.
My black friends even thinks this is so blown out of proportion. And you know what, these are my friends yes, but they also have a grip on their lives, and don't take this stuff personally, because it doesn't change who they are!
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Okay... so what Chris is saying and Permafrog.... rap doesn't define the black race. Okay fine... didn't say it did.
So then why don't they [blacks and outraged white people] stand up in arms at what is being said by rappers about "niggers" and "ho's"? Why make a federal case out of what this white shock jock said?? It is SO MILD compared to the black rappers.
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@ Leah:
My black friends even thinks this is so blown out of proportion. And you know what, these are my friends yes, but they also have a grip on their lives, and don't take this stuff personally, because it doesn't change who they are!
I totally agree this has been made into a media circus. I'm lucky I'm in Canada where the media is talking about more than this -- I can't watch CNN :)
As for comparing Imus to Stern? Stern is a shock jock but doesn't say anything like this with this context. -
wow. I liked this song but I didn't know it was being racist.
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Here is an interesting quote I just found, made by Al Sharpton.
“This has never been about Don Imus,” Mr. Sharpton said. “I have no idea whether he is a good man or not. This is about the use of public airwaves for bigoted, racist speech.”
Someone should point "Reverend" Sharpton to Scoop's article. I'd love to hear his response.
Quote from this article on the New York Times website -
You know, my heart aches for Don Imus. He truly is a sacrificial lamb - in most part because the "topic of the week" is black vs white - and he made a major faux paux...Now he has been thrown to the wolves. A media frenzy can ensue, and we can fill the airwaves with something besides Britney shaving her head and checking into rehab, or what drugs were found in Anna Nicole's hotel room.
I found this when I googled Don's name. It took me until #203 to pull it up. I hesitated to post it, because I don't want to sling any more mud in this man's direction. But, to illustrate the point that this guy has been saying controversial stuff for quite some time, here you have it:
On the Wednesday, Jan. 18, 2006 edition of "Imus in the Morning" on MSNBC, host Don Imus and guest Chris Matthews (host of MSNBC's "Hardball with Chris Matthews" and NBC News' "The Chris Matthews Show") used an exchange about "Brokeback Mountain" to engage in a sophomoric display of homophobia.
After Matthews quoted anti-gay radio personality Michael Savage as having called the film "Bareback Mounting," Imus added that one of his show's staff members had titled the film "Fudgepack Mountain." A video clip and complete transcript of Imus and Matthews' exchange are available at http://www.glaad.org.
Ummmmm - do you remember any sort of media outcry when this incident occurred? Did this homophobic statement make national news? No - why? Well, probably because in January 2006 there was something bigger and better and juicier going on, and it just slid under the radar.
To take a man like Don Imus, who has always been controversial to say the least, and then just suddenly, out of the blue, decide that he is the devil incarnate for uttering those 3 words regarding the Rutger's basketball women, and hang him out to dry, to disregard all of the good this man has done, to destroy a 40 year career over 3 little words, merely because it is a "slow" news week is just sinful! Pure and simple.
My heart goes out to Don....seriously. He's always been who he is - the beast (aka the media) has just decided to throw him to the wolves. -
Don Imus a "sacrificial lamb"? Please, the man hosts a nationally syndicated radio show and he is ultimately responsible for the language that he chooses to use.
First off, his show has a history of racially offensive vernacular being condoned, from Venus and Serena Williams being called "animals better suited to pose for National Geographic than Playboy", to numerous simian references to black athletes.
Secondly, rap music with offensive lyrics are always censored before being broadcast over the airwaves. Does this make such music any less palatable? No.
However, it is intellectually dishonest to equate the comments Don Imus made with Rap music lyrics, for you see much about the way language is interpreted is in the context that words are used. Words do not always have an absolute value in and of themselves, most of the time it is the individual using them that establishes their meaning; again, context.
Chris indeed understands this and explained it eloquently, but I will revisit it. Much about hip hop is gritty and grimy because it was born of the inner city streets. Don Imus is an outsider.
As in other cultures, there are terms that are used between members of that group that would be considered insulting if used by an outsider, especially one known to not be sympathetic to that group.
You may not want to hear this, but if I were to hear "MC so and so" use the term "nappy headed ho" I know where he is coming from even if I find it coarse. Conversely, when I hear a 67 year old white male use the term "nappy headed ho" I also know where he is coming from and it is not a place (or time for that matter) simpatico to the black community.
Do I feel that this controversy is probably overblown? Yes. However, the predicament that Imus finds himself in is of his own making. There are lines that even a shock jock like Howard Stern doesn't cross. This is a case of Don Imus crossing that line once too often.
I always find it interesting that when some public figure (usually a white conservative - ha!) says something intended to be offensive to black people and black people react with indignation, the follow up response is: "they are overly sensitive" or "well they say it too", and my all time favorite: "they are playing the race card (Leah)." Well who dealt the card in the first place? Better yet, who put the card in the deck?
From the responses of many of you, I can see that there is still a lot of animosity towards black people in general. In response to Lightening: I have never heard the term "niggers" used in rap music, "niggaz" yes. But since the culture is alien and probably threatening to you, I suppose you would not notice subtle nuances like that, let alone appreciate them.
It seems like many of you missed the point and the issue merely became a sounding board for how much "I hate rap music", or for some of you, the problems that you have with black people. Perhaps it is just defensiveness. Christopher Hogg I am deeply thankful for your understanding of this matter.
My personal vision is that ultimately we are all thrown into this thing called life together, so let us make it a little easier for one another and show each other some understanding. After all, we are all just droplets contained in a much larger ocean.
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The derogatory statements of Imus and his cohorts has always been hateful mean-spirited, towards Blacks in particular. I personally feel that his statements are intended to demean Blacks and to uplift the spirits of his bigoted White listening audience. It helps to make those White folks feel better about themselves.
But I will agree that young Blacks need to make better choices in the imagery that they would like to portray, or tend to enjoy. In discussing this matter with the young White friends of my son Greg, they understand the outrage that some Blacks are feeling towards Imus. In spite of their enjoyment of rap music, they would not disrespect a Black friend by maliciously disrespecting their women.
Imus is a 66 year old White punk who knew just how offensive he was being when he made those statements. There is no justification for "Punk Boy Imus" for ever including such language in his commentary. If he is to survive in radio and television broadcasting, this "Cowboy Queen" will have to make some real changes and eat a little crow while he is at it.
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I still say it is the "flavor of the week" club in media land....if all that you say is true about the statements Imus has made in the past, then why, now, is he being taken down? Why allow this 66 year old white boy to spend the past 40 some years spewing his, according to you, racial comments with no repercussions? Then, suddenly, out of the blue, turn on him like a pack of media wolves and rip him to pieces for the pure enjoyment of the sheeple public.......pretty loaded deck if I do say so myself!
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@ Lightening:
Okay... so what Chris is saying and Permafrog.... rap doesn't define the black race. Okay fine... didn't say it did.
So then why don't they [blacks and outraged white people] stand up in arms at what is being said by rappers about "niggers" and "ho's"? Why make a federal case out of what this white shock jock said?? It is SO MILD compared to the black rappers.
did you read this? -
@ Bob Ewing :
did you read this?
So what is your point? There are plenty of groups that represent change for the better. This website/group is not the equivalent of the public outcry on all the news channels and talk shows being directed at Imus.
My point was that considering the vile and horrific rap lyrics being spewed.... one can't help but wonder where the black public outcry is against it. An outcry more along the lines of what we see relative to Imus. -
@ Lightening:
So what is your point? There are plenty of groups that represent change for the better. This website/group is not the equivalent of the public outcry on all the news channels and talk shows being directed at Imus.
My point was that considering the vile and horrific rap lyrics being spewed.... one can't help but wonder where the black public outcry is against it. An outcry more along the lines of what we see relative to Imus.
My point is simple, there are groups raising the issue. Why do you and others not include them in your posts? This would raise the profile and perhaps start the outcry you desire. -
@ Bob Ewing :
did you read this?
I read it to. So, you're saying that because a group of people in the black community are organizing a forum to discuss the messages in hip hop (I note they don't call it rap, or aren't discussing rap?) then what? They are addressing it, so we white folk better just shut up about it? Never mind cuz they have it all under control? Please..............
Don Imus was thrown to the media wolves for the viewing publics enjoyment. Nothing like a good race war to amp up the tension in the room! Gives people something to talk about. Who cares whose career it destroys in the wake, right? Who cares if Imus has contributed $1,000's to worthy causes. Has been a contributor to society in so many other good ways. He called some female basketball players "nappy headed ho's" and for that he should be hung. Right? Geez...................... -
@ Pamela Jean (GotTheScoop):
I read it to. So, you're saying that because a group of people in the black community are organizing a forum to discuss the messages in hip hop (I note they don't call it rap, or aren't discussing rap?) then what? They are addressing it, so we white folk better just shut up about it? Never mind cuz they have it all under control?
He called some female basketball players "nappy headed ho's" and for that he should be hung. Right? Geez......................
No, I am saying and it should be obvious that there are those who are raising the issue period. So acknowledge that if you want any credibility. Now as to your next statement did I say shut up no, you are free to express your opinions even when they are wrong and poorly informed so have fun, but do not translate what i said. Don was wrong Don is gone, This is good. -
some background
hip hop
More.-
Hello GotTheScoop. That 66 year old white punk just took it too far this time, and he is really paying the price. Imus has already lost his MSNBC radio show. Maybe he can salvage his career after meeting with the Rutgers women's basketball team, later today. The "Cowboy Queen" will have to eat lots of crow for lunch today.
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Hello permafrog. I like your handling of GotTheScoop in the Don Imus fiasco.
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Well, I appreciate your alerting me to this yesterday GTS, but I just got to see it right now. I found this interesting & even more so by all the differing comments & views.
I'm afraid I don't have much to add since I don't have a clue who Imus is, don't think I care to, & Sharpton & Jackson are less than donkeys' behinds to me.
There's some "soft" rap songs I like - I don't listen to the trash stuff. Don't care to even hear about it.
I upvoted some people who made great arguments for their points of view - even though y'all were at opposite sides.
Good debate.
:)
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@ Brandigal (Donna):I also believe if you want to stop certain words from being said, it has to stop on all sides. Why is it ok for one race to use certain words but if someone else uses the same words in the same context but they are a different race, it is bad. I do not understand this.
Brandi, first off when used by others, it is the intention behind the words that comes into question.
You are absolutely correct though... People cannot get over the terminologies because it is more confusing when one side can use the terms (while speaking of themselves) and the other side continues to use those terms with negative connotations. All groups, need to stop using these terms in order for the world to stop using them. Until that happens, people will continue to be offended.
In fact squidny said it perfectly: It seems like many of you missed the point and the issue merely became a sounding board for how much "I hate rap music", or for some of you, the problems that you have with black people. Perhaps it is just defensiveness. Christopher Hogg I am deeply thankful for your understanding of this matter.
My personal vision is that ultimately we are all thrown into this thing called life together, so let us make it a little easier for one another and show each other some understanding. After all, we are all just droplets contained in a much larger ocean
GTS you ask the question why now? I wondered this too but really: Why not now? And why aren't other groups also offended and up in arms? Where are the women's groups? Maybe their voices are not as "media worthy" and therfore are not heard as loudly. Maybe everyone is just plain tired of the racist, bigotry. hateful/hurtful remarks that is happening within the "people of influence" and more of them are being outed, thus bringing the whole issue to the forefront. We have seen many articles here on DJ that touch on this very issue....in fact there are 44 articles on that topic alone.
Now is as good a time as it was in Martin Luther King's day and any day is better than sweeping it all under the carpet. -
I was listening to MSNBC about an hour ago. There was a black man from some organization discussing the problem with rap music and how it is perpetuating this on society.
He indicated that the problem with what Imus said wasn't that he called the women "ho's" as that has become the norm in the black culture, but that he had referred to their hair as "nappy headed"! He pointed out that the man in conversation with Imus at the time had called them "ho's" as well and mentioned something about tatoos - but that guy is off scott free.....so the issue is "nappy headed"?
Hard to believe, but that is what they said. And, it is a fact that the man speaking to Imus called them "ho's" first.
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Great debate here, nice civilized, anyway all those people out there should learn to respect one another, other wise we will see more and more like this. The real victims are those Rutgers Women and Coach, hope Imus say Sorry and means it. I just read he is fired by CBS. Sad ending for a guy, all his good career points gone because of three words, while others are still around. Well done GTS.
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word on the street is that, prior to his comment, Imus had challenged all of these ladies to a game of horse, but none of them ever got to r...
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@ Khee Mao:
word on the street is that, prior to his comment, Imus had challenged all of these ladies to a game of horse, but none of them ever got to r...
Ah yes, the wisdom of Khee Mao. See I missed that! Nice the read your comments again Khee. Interesting post and comments. There are valid points on both sides. So let the chips fall where they may. -
Scoop, as a follow up to your post, I was watching Meet The Press earlier today and the roundtable discussion focussed totally on the Don Imus situation. They showed a videotape of a Chrysler ad and Tim Russert made the statement "This is what the head of Chrysler advertising said, a spokesperson: 'It's a great way to continue to break through the clutter. Snoop is a hip-hop icon, a lot of people know him and recognize him, so it’s a fun complement to Lee.' It's the same Snoop Dogg who uses the B-word, the N-word, the, the H-word. He, on MTV, appeared with women on dog collars." And how did Gwen Ifill, a moderator and the Managing Editor of Washington Week, respond? "So we're all hypocrites, Tim. Let's see what we can do to get past it. We can go back and we can say, 'Look, everybody else has done this.' That doesn't take any away—anything away from the, the moment of what we are seeing right now. And matter of fact, it gives us a chance to—I never saw the ad with Snoop Dogg and Lee Iacocca. Great ad. But I'm just saying, I know what he was trying to do. It was a business imperative. They're trying to reach—they're trying to survive. They're trying to reach a different kind of, of car buyer who wouldn't otherwise pay attention to a Chrysler commercial. It's not acceptable."
She goes through this huge defense of Chrysler, calls it a "great ad" and then says it's not acceptable. I still don't get why everyone is so upset with Mr. Imus and yet still implicitly go along with the blatantly racist and misogynist attitudes of rappers and others in the black community at large.
And finally, when Tim Russert asked "Gwen Ifill, you mentioned turning off the, the rap music. How do you respond to people who say, “Turn of Imus? If you don’t like him, turn him off”?" Ms. Ifill said "I never watched Imus, never listened to Imus."
Which is exactly how it should be. Mr. Imus apologized and his apology was accepted. End of story. If you don't want to listen, turn off the radio.
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Thanks for that addition GHL. I agree so whole heartedly. The guy practically ate dog crap crawling on the floor apologizing, but no one would forgive.
He has been saying controversial stuff for years an years - so how it is OK to suddenly change the rules in the middle of the game?
If you have been saying rude stuff about gays, women, blacks, indians, you name it - and no one ever says BOO - and then suddenly, out of the blue you are totally Sh*t canned for doing what you've been doing forever and a day - how is that fair! Hypocrites seem to rule in this little affair.
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@ Pamela Jean (GotTheScoop):
Thanks for that addition GHL. I agree so whole heartedly. The guy practically ate dog crap crawling on the floor apologizing, but no one would forgive.
He has been saying controversial stuff for years an years - so how it is OK to suddenly change the rules in the middle of the game?
If you have been saying rude stuff about gays, women, blacks, indians, you name it - and no one ever says BOO - and then suddenly, out of the blue you are totally Sh*t canned for doing what you've been doing forever and a day - how is that fair! Hypocrites seem to rule in this little affair.
I definitely agree with you here -- he has been doing it for ages and it's amazing this took him down.
I keep hearing about people who had no clue who he was before, so that could be it: When the media picks up on it like it did, it went viral and advertisers likely started pulling spots. The network had no choice but to get rid of him -- forget what he said, as a business he cost them money. -
Actually, Chris you are right about the business aspect. I think that is the bottom line, advertisers started pulling out of MSNBC as a whole and that was the real impetus behind Imus getting the ax. Pretty sad state of affairs.
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